EPISTLES

In a recent interview with the Catholic Herald, Cardinal Gerhard Ludwig Müller, a prominent German Catholic prelate and theologian, spoke clearly and firmly about the ongoing situation of the Society of St. Pius X (SSPX). His remarks address a long-standing issue in the Church: how to pursue unity and dialogue without sacrificing Catholic doctrine and authority.

This article explains Cardinal Müller’s main points in simple terms, with background to help readers understand why his words matter.

The SSPX: A Long-Standing Challenge

The SSPX was founded by Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre in 1970. While many of its members are truly devoted to Traditional Catholic worship and teaching, the group has had serious conflicts with the Church, especially regarding the Second Vatican Council (1962–1965).

The situation of the SSPX is both pastoral (about caring for souls) and theological (about truth and doctrine). For decades, the Church has engaged in talks with the SSPX to heal divisions and restore full communion.

However, Cardinal Müller says these dialogues have largely gone in circles.

Vatican II Is Not Optional

One of Cardinal Müller’s strongest points is this: the Second Vatican Council must be recognized as a true Ecumenical Council of the Catholic Church.

There is, he says, “no way around” this fact.

Vatican II was not a mistake, nor is it something the Church can later cancel or rewrite. Like all ecumenical councils before it, it belongs fully to the Church’s living tradition. Cardinal Müller stresses that Vatican II must be understood correctly—using Catholic principles of interpretation that go back to the early Church, including the teachings of St. Irenaeus of Lyon.

Disagreement, confusion, or even criticism of how Vatican II was implemented does not justify rejecting the Council itself.

Rejecting Sedevacantism and False Claims

Cardinal Müller also strongly rejects ideas that often appear in traditionalist circles, including claims that the Chair of St. Peter is vacant (“sede vacante”), calls to revise or undo Vatican II, the belief that the Lefebvrist movement is the last true remnant of Catholicism.

He calls this kind of thinking foolish and dangerous. While acknowledging that some post-conciliar reforms caused real harm—especially when driven by modernist or self-appointed reformers—he insists that separating from the Church is never justified.

Saints and Sinners in the Church

To explain this, Cardinal Müller points to St. Augustine, who fought against the Donatist sect in the early Church. The Donatists claimed that moral failures within the Church invalidated her authority and sacraments.

St. Augustine firmly rejected this idea. He taught that the Church is always a mixture of saints and sinners, yet remains the true Church of Christ.

Quoting Augustine’s Answer to the Letters of Petilian the Donatist, Cardinal Müller reminds readers that it was not the Church who separated herself from the Donatists — but it is the Donatists who separated themselves from the Church. They withdrew from communion with the universal Church.

The lesson is clear: holiness is not preserved by leaving the Church.

Unity Comes Through Peter

Cardinal Müller ends with a call to unity, saying that now is the kairos—a decisive moment—for Catholics to reunite in the truth of Christ.

Christ established unity through St. Peter and his successors, including the current pope, Pope Leo XIV. Vatican II itself teaches that the Pope is the lasting foundation of unity in faith and sacramental life (Lumen gentium, 18).

True Catholic unity does not come from isolation or resistance, but from communion with the universal Church.

A Clear Message

Cardinal Müller’s message is direct: Vatican II is part of Catholic Tradition, real abuses do not justify separation, the Church remains the Church, despite her wounds, and that unity with the Pope is essential.

His words challenge all Catholics—especially those drawn to Tradition—to remain firmly rooted in truth and communion, without choosing one against the other.

Interview Excerpt

Jan Bentz: The situation of the SSPX remains a pastoral and theological challenge. What, in your judgment, is the most fruitful way for the Church to approach dialogue with the Lefebvrian movement while preserving unity and doctrinal integrity?

Cardinal Gerhard L. Müller: There have been — and continue to be — endless dialogues with this group, but they simply circle around. There is no way around recognising the Second Vatican Council as the twenty-first Ecumenical Council of the Catholic Church, in accordance with the Catholic hermeneutic and epistemology already fully articulated by Irenaeus of Lyon.

The foolish talk of a “sede vacante” of the Chair of Peter, calls for a revision of the Council, and the claim that the Lefebvrists are the last bastion of true Catholicity must finally come to an end. Even if they are right to place their finger on the wounds inflicted on the Body of Christ by self-appointed reformers in the style of Modernism, there is never a justification for distancing oneself from the Catholic Church — even though the Church is a mixture of saints and sinners, as St Augustine emphasised against the strict and self-righteous Donatist sect.

Against Petilianus, the highly educated leader of the Donatists, he declared: “It was not we who separated ourselves from you — you separated yourselves from us. You withdrew from communion with the universal Church” (Contra litteras Petiliani II, 38).

Now is the kairos for all Catholics to reunite in the truth of Christ, who in the person of St Peter and his successor — Pope Leo XIV — has established an enduring principle and foundation of unity in faith and sacramental communion (Vatican II, Lumen gentium 18).

Source: Jan Bentz. (2025, December 12). Interview: Cardinal Müller on Europe, Islam, the SSPX and the German Synodal Path (J. Bentz, Interviewer). The Catholic Herald.